A couple of notes:
Uhm, so I started typing a post sometime last week about my favorite Fall Out Boy songs, and why I love them. I'm not really a music fan, though, honestly, so much as I am a slash fan. So what ended up happening was that I wrote about them as canon resources, rather than as songs. And then I got out the tinfoil. And then I wrote a giant fucking treatise on G.I.N.A.S.F.S. So, uh, instead of my ten favorite songs, you get – my very favorite song! With a buttload of speculation.
DISCLAIMER: THIS IS ALL MADE UP, OKAY, PROBABLY THIS SONG IS ACTUALLY NOT ABOUT PETE AND PATRICK'S BIG GAY LOVE IN THE REAL LIFES, PUT ON THE T-SHIRT MARKED "FICTION." ALSO GO AWAY PETE WENTZ, STOP READING LJ, THANKS.
[Download]
The first thing about G.I.N.A.S.F.S. that pings me as a slasher is this: Pete has, canonically, put good songs on a lower publicity track than they might otherwise merit, because they had great personal meaning to him. In today's Q&A confirming that Hum Hallelujah will not be the next single from Infinity on High, he explicitly said that the reason it won't be a single is that it means something special to him.
G.I.N.A.S.F.S. is a great song. I'm a pop fan, I'm an average consumer, I tend to like things that other people like. I've got ordinary taste! And this song? By far my favorite track off the album. This track could absolutely be a hit for them, I don't doubt it for a minute. But somehow, it barely made it to release. It was a bonus track, y'all! The other bonus track is bad! I don't think it's honestly much of a stretch to say that this song may possibly have deep personal meaning to Pete. And it's called GAY IS NOT A SYNONYM FOR SHITTY. Excuse me while I go die.
So with that in mind, let's move on to a line-by-line interpretation of the text!
I should first say: I think there are two "you"s in this song, at the very least. (Damn you, Pete, and your lack of names and referents!) This is fairly unambiguously, I think, a song about switching one love for another, a destructive one for one that feels like home. It's a song about trading in a bad model of relationships for one that works. So the first "you" in this passage refers to his ex(es), and possibly also to the new love on the horizon – he loves the things about people that hurt him most. The second you, in "Let me see your moves," is the new love, and the lyric is about giving a healthier relationship a chance. With kisses!
Okay, fuck this "new love" nonsense, I'm going to put on my tinhat and start saying what we're both thinking: PATRICK IS HIS HOME. Pete wants to do this Big Gay Love thing, even if it's hard, because Patrick is his home, he's what makes him feel okay. He's willing to make the biggest effort for him, because he's worth it.
Things have changed since he's figured himself out. He can't pretend life is remotely the way it was when he didn't know he was in love with Patrick, but at the same time, he finds himself wanting to fall back into old habits. The implied you here is an ex who wasn't right for him, and he knows that, but it's hard not to crawl back to the old mode of being. OR, he knows he should be avoiding calling Patrick just to hear his voice, but when he's feeling low, it's hard not to do it anyway. Possibly both meanings could apply simultaneously? He's hovering on the edge of making a stupid move, whatever the case.
Uhhhhm. First of all, this is pretty queer even if it's about a girl, n'est-ce pa?
There's double entendre here, I think. "Supposed to love you" can be taken in two ways at once – the "you" he's expected to love, and the "you" he's destined to love. He's supposed to be with Patrick, even though it's strange – Patrick isn't who he would have expected to fall for in a million years. But he's supposed to love him. It's fate! Meanwhile, he's also "supposed" to love girls, according to society, but doesn't. Mmm, clever Pete.
Also also, dudes, that buzznet post Pete just made about wearing a sweatshirt that smells like his best friend and makes him feel not lonely. THIS IS OUR CANON.
(I'm not going to get into the "baby blues for wide-eyed browns" thing, because ugh, do not want. Poetic license is too much of a factor here, and I don't even know what color any of their eyes are – does Jeanae have blue eyes? Whatever, I seriously don't care, it's a metaphor. More than one "you," that's all I claim.)
He wants to take the plunge and tell Patrick how he feels, but he can't bring himself to do it, and keeps wimping out. And he's emo. (This is not news.) Possibly "given up on myself" is also a reference to two serious, bad exes – Morgan and Jeanae? Who knows. (Also, poss. allow for poetic license with regard to numbers.)
Realizing that he's in love with Patrick is something he not only didn't want to do, but actually tried not to do. But thoughts of Patrick are what keep him sane when he's depressed – or, you know, Patrick singing him to sleep, whatever. His heart always comes back to this one place, to his home, and so in the end he couldn't avoid figuring himself out.
"Photo-proofed kisses," to me, is always going to evoke Mikey Way. It's kind of inevitable, considering how they (allegedly) avoided being photographed together. And "the roof of your hotel" denotes that they were staying in different hotels, so it can't be Patrick. And "you saved my life" is totally an MCR reference, dudes! In conclusion, this verse is about Mikey, I think.
In
kalpurna's world of tinhats, the point of these lines is that Mikey showed him how to have a good relationship, even though it didn't work out with them. He wasn't actively destructive, which was pretty exciting for Pete. Pete was born under a bad sign, had bad luck in love – then finally had a good relationship, and it was with a dude. And when that ended, his eyes were open to see Patrick.
To my mind, G.I.N.A.S.F.S. was titled that because this is a song largely about his big male romance (and his first male romance) and how those were totes better for him than any of his girlfriends ever were. Gay is not a synonym for shitty, because for Pete, gay relationships have been the only ones that were any good. The title is a statement of defiance, and a declaration of intent – screw who he's "supposed" to love, he's going with who he's supposed to love. Uh, if that makes any sense.
UHM. SO THAT WAS A LOT OF SPECULATION. And it was pretty inarticulate, because I'm tres tired, but. What do you all think? Did your mileage vary? Am I pulling this out of my ass? What is the REAL deal with this song?
- We... win? *tentative Paul Gross arms*
- You should still join
fandom_counts, because, well. History does tend to repeat itself. Also, it's fun to watch the member count climb! - My birthday was made of awesome! I had good food with great friends and got an adorable haircut in an interesting neighborhood I'd never been to before. A++ all around. \o/
Uhm, so I started typing a post sometime last week about my favorite Fall Out Boy songs, and why I love them. I'm not really a music fan, though, honestly, so much as I am a slash fan. So what ended up happening was that I wrote about them as canon resources, rather than as songs. And then I got out the tinfoil. And then I wrote a giant fucking treatise on G.I.N.A.S.F.S. So, uh, instead of my ten favorite songs, you get – my very favorite song! With a buttload of speculation.
DISCLAIMER: THIS IS ALL MADE UP, OKAY, PROBABLY THIS SONG IS ACTUALLY NOT ABOUT PETE AND PATRICK'S BIG GAY LOVE IN THE REAL LIFES, PUT ON THE T-SHIRT MARKED "FICTION." ALSO GO AWAY PETE WENTZ, STOP READING LJ, THANKS.
The first thing about G.I.N.A.S.F.S. that pings me as a slasher is this: Pete has, canonically, put good songs on a lower publicity track than they might otherwise merit, because they had great personal meaning to him. In today's Q&A confirming that Hum Hallelujah will not be the next single from Infinity on High, he explicitly said that the reason it won't be a single is that it means something special to him.
G.I.N.A.S.F.S. is a great song. I'm a pop fan, I'm an average consumer, I tend to like things that other people like. I've got ordinary taste! And this song? By far my favorite track off the album. This track could absolutely be a hit for them, I don't doubt it for a minute. But somehow, it barely made it to release. It was a bonus track, y'all! The other bonus track is bad! I don't think it's honestly much of a stretch to say that this song may possibly have deep personal meaning to Pete. And it's called GAY IS NOT A SYNONYM FOR SHITTY. Excuse me while I go die.
So with that in mind, let's move on to a line-by-line interpretation of the text!
I've loved everything about you that hurts
So let me see your moves, let me see your moves
Lips pressed close to mine, true blue
I should first say: I think there are two "you"s in this song, at the very least. (Damn you, Pete, and your lack of names and referents!) This is fairly unambiguously, I think, a song about switching one love for another, a destructive one for one that feels like home. It's a song about trading in a bad model of relationships for one that works. So the first "you" in this passage refers to his ex(es), and possibly also to the new love on the horizon – he loves the things about people that hurt him most. The second you, in "Let me see your moves," is the new love, and the lyric is about giving a healthier relationship a chance. With kisses!
But the prince of any failing empire knows that
Everybody wants, everybody wants
To drive on through the night, if it's a drive back home
Okay, fuck this "new love" nonsense, I'm going to put on my tinhat and start saying what we're both thinking: PATRICK IS HIS HOME. Pete wants to do this Big Gay Love thing, even if it's hard, because Patrick is his home, he's what makes him feel okay. He's willing to make the biggest effort for him, because he's worth it.
Things aren't the same anymore
Some nights it gets so bad
I almost pick up the phone
Things have changed since he's figured himself out. He can't pretend life is remotely the way it was when he didn't know he was in love with Patrick, but at the same time, he finds himself wanting to fall back into old habits. The implied you here is an ex who wasn't right for him, and he knows that, but it's hard not to crawl back to the old mode of being. OR, he knows he should be avoiding calling Patrick just to hear his voice, but when he's feeling low, it's hard not to do it anyway. Possibly both meanings could apply simultaneously? He's hovering on the edge of making a stupid move, whatever the case.
Trade baby blues for wide eyed browns
I sleep with your old shirts
And walk through this house in your shoes
I know it's strange
It's a strange way of saying
That I know I'm supposed to love you
I'm supposed to love you
Uhhhhm. First of all, this is pretty queer even if it's about a girl, n'est-ce pa?
There's double entendre here, I think. "Supposed to love you" can be taken in two ways at once – the "you" he's expected to love, and the "you" he's destined to love. He's supposed to be with Patrick, even though it's strange – Patrick isn't who he would have expected to fall for in a million years. But he's supposed to love him. It's fate! Meanwhile, he's also "supposed" to love girls, according to society, but doesn't. Mmm, clever Pete.
Also also, dudes, that buzznet post Pete just made about wearing a sweatshirt that smells like his best friend and makes him feel not lonely. THIS IS OUR CANON.
(I'm not going to get into the "baby blues for wide-eyed browns" thing, because ugh, do not want. Poetic license is too much of a factor here, and I don't even know what color any of their eyes are – does Jeanae have blue eyes? Whatever, I seriously don't care, it's a metaphor. More than one "you," that's all I claim.)
I've already given up on myself twice
Third time is the charm, third time is the charm
Throw caution to the wind, but I've got a lousy arm
He wants to take the plunge and tell Patrick how he feels, but he can't bring himself to do it, and keeps wimping out. And he's emo. (This is not news.) Possibly "given up on myself" is also a reference to two serious, bad exes – Morgan and Jeanae? Who knows. (Also, poss. allow for poetic license with regard to numbers.)
And I've traced your shadows on the wall, now I kiss them
Whenever I'm down, whenever I'm down
Figured on not figuring myself out
Realizing that he's in love with Patrick is something he not only didn't want to do, but actually tried not to do. But thoughts of Patrick are what keep him sane when he's depressed – or, you know, Patrick singing him to sleep, whatever. His heart always comes back to this one place, to his home, and so in the end he couldn't avoid figuring himself out.
Born under a bad sign, you saved my life
That night on the roof of your hotel
"Cross my heart and hope to die, splinter from the headboard in my eye"
Photo-proofed kisses I remember so well
"Photo-proofed kisses," to me, is always going to evoke Mikey Way. It's kind of inevitable, considering how they (allegedly) avoided being photographed together. And "the roof of your hotel" denotes that they were staying in different hotels, so it can't be Patrick. And "you saved my life" is totally an MCR reference, dudes! In conclusion, this verse is about Mikey, I think.
In
To my mind, G.I.N.A.S.F.S. was titled that because this is a song largely about his big male romance (and his first male romance) and how those were totes better for him than any of his girlfriends ever were. Gay is not a synonym for shitty, because for Pete, gay relationships have been the only ones that were any good. The title is a statement of defiance, and a declaration of intent – screw who he's "supposed" to love, he's going with who he's supposed to love. Uh, if that makes any sense.
UHM. SO THAT WAS A LOT OF SPECULATION. And it was pretty inarticulate, because I'm tres tired, but. What do you all think? Did your mileage vary? Am I pulling this out of my ass? What is the REAL deal with this song?
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perfectly accurate interpretation ofspeculation over the song, and was a most entertaining read.And though my inner slasher is doing cartwheels over the obvious truth of Pete's Big Gay Love for Patrick, the part of me that is most infuriatingly intent on pointing out that it's all just speculation really wants to know what Pete was thinking when he wrote this.
I mean, the song itself is clearly about self-destructive relationships vs. 'coming home' to something more stable and, in the end, more worthwhile. Which is nice, straight-forward Pete material, really. But give it a title like GINASFS, and suddenly, woah.
Maybe he just went all alternative-point-of-view on us and decided to write a song from a gay man's perspective (THIS IS IGNORING THE FACT THAT WENTZ OBVIOUSLY HAS THE HOTS FOR STUMP) just because. Still, though. It's completely fascinating. Especially as it obviously means so much to him.
Gay supporters FTW. What an awesome guy. :D
So yeah. That was entertaining. xD
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And the page won't load for me, but is that page link news on the whole witch-hunt bullshit on questionable LJ interests? I made the rantiest, angriest and most emotionally psycho entry on my LJ just last night concerning the whole thing, and it would be nice to know that something positive has come out of all the indignation, because wow, did I give myself a headache. :D
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It is indeed. The CEO of Six Apart made a post on
Besides, I really don't want to leave LJ. *clings*
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Dude, I have a LOT more trouble figuring out what this song is supposed to mean in the actual lifes than in my slashy interpretation. I mean, ugh, I guess it's about... Ashlee? But I honestly don't think the timing works out for that one. Or, well, when did he start dating her? I don't know, blah, RPS canon is so confusing.
I think we should probably keep in mind that yeah, not all songs are non-fiction, and this might be more about some speculative future "you" than
Patrickanyone specific. But on the other hand, Pete writes about his own life much more than many lyricists do. So, uhm. I don't have a clue, is basically what I'm saying here.On the other hand, no matter who it's about, how much do I love that Pete is apparently ready to look for a non-destructive relationship? LOTS. Oh, Pete, please: no more Bad Dating Decisions! At least Ashlee hasn't, as far as we know, cheated on you. (Twice.) (In the same weekend.)
And re: the title – I KNOW. I mean, GOD, PETE, WHAT IS WITH THAT NOISE. Usually the titles have some sort of marginal relationship to the material, right? They're not, like, picked out of a HAT? Not that I'm complaining! One little song title has never brought so many people so much joy, for serious.
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not all songs are non-fiction
In my personal experience (I write songs, and sing them to myself, and a lot of my favorite artists write songs that are very clearly fictional- but it's funny, because there are so many artists who write songs which could be true. God, I love music and lyrics that matter.), most songs are totally made up. I mean, the emotions are real, but the content is not. But it's tons of fun to figure them out anyway.
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And absolutely, dude. I'm not a composer at all, but I'm a dabbler in poetry, which seems similar. AUTHOR ≠ NARRATOR! Even when it's in first person! *glares into the past at Certain Members of her poetry class*
But wow, I'm having a lot of fun treating the lyrics as canon texts to interpret – even though I know most of what I come up with will be totally off base. It's such an interesting kind of canon to work with, like a combination of poetry analysis and interview interpretation and slash goggles and imagination. Oh, bandom, I love you so! ♥
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And hi! I added you to my flist and I spend a horrifying amount of time reading your friends list for all things bandslash related. So...that sounds creepy and stalker-like. Really, I'm just a huge, harmless dork.
I'm not a composer at all, but I'm a dabbler in poetry, which seems similar. AUTHOR ≠ NARRATOR! Even when it's in first person! *glares into the past at Certain Members of her poetry class*
Yes! See, my favorite musicians are poets- their songs are poetry put to music. Lyrics are the most important thing to me- I'm a very word-obsessed person, and I love music, and I'm not saying I don't listen to music with ridiculous lyrics, but most of the stuff I love beyond reason is poetry set to music. (Like, Thea Gilmore and Richard Thompson are poets and musicians at the same time and I love them for that. Love.)
See, bandom is where songfic makes the most sense to me. The lyrics and music are cannon. I mean, they are what these people do for a living, and sure we're wearing slash goggles, but it's totally a from of poetry, which is always open to interpretation. And I totally miss my college poetry classes like woah.
In conclusion: bandom is love!
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Okay, this is not a dig to her (because I don't care if Pete dates her I just don't think she should be famous as she is, um, lacking talent) but I highly doubt even if it's about a woman it's about Ashlee. I don't see that as being a long-term thing. If you look at the people Pete gravitates towards, Ashlee appears to be the total opposite. Which, hey, maybe she's all emotional fucked too and they really connect, awesome, whatever, but I don't feel it.
And I love that song too. Although the first time I heard it some of what I *thought* Patrick was saying had me damn near crying with laughter.
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Is it as good as Jimi Hendrix "'Scuse me while I kiss this guy" screw-up?
(Actual lyrics being "'scuse me while I kiss the sky")
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Although, honestly, it took months for me to understand that the 2nd stanza of "Sugar" wasn't "tell mommy I'm watching youtube from the closet". :D
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Hahahahaha OH PATRICK, please don't ever learn to enunciate, it is much funnier this way.
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Seriously. Between "dry hump through the night" and something about fingering himself around the third stanza my jaw was on the floor. I thought Pete had lost his everlovin' mind! Patrick! Speak CLEARLY!
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Do you have tin hats for sale? I think I need to add one to my wardrobe.
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You can make one in your VERY OWN HOME. All you need is some tinfoil and a lot of delusion!!
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Also, I love you, because I've done this with this song. Nowhere near as well, or concisely, but I've sat and looked at this song, and come up with really similar conclusions.
You = ftw.
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Yayyy thanks! I'm so glad you
don't think I'm crazyenjoyed it!(no subject)
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Also, has anyone analyzed Famous Last Words yet? In addition to being an awesome song (and Gerard, unlike Pete, seems to deliberately release stuff that's personal to him, I wonder why?) there's so much information about it! Like the way Ray was playing his guitar too fast after Mikey left, and Gerard heard him and they sat down and worked on the song for the first time, and the way the other guys left and Gerard wrote and recorded the chorus while they were gone, or the way he broke up with his girlfriend afterwards, or whatever else I haven't read. (Also, I can tell I just spent most of last weekend working on my English portfolio, because there's a little voice in the back of my head going IS THIS MLA OR APA and CITE YOUR SOURCES and ONE PAGE DOWN, THREE TO GO, basically academia will be the death of me.)
Oh my god, this comment is way too long, I'm sorry. Blame the strikethrough, it's turned me into a rambler. :/
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You should totally do it yourself!!! I want to read lots and lots of different theories about ALL the songs by ALL the bands. It's so much fun to explore. I want to read all about Famous Last Words, GO.
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Oh, boys! I love them so. They really do make it too easy for us. Now I have to go find this buzznet thing you're talking about, because OMBsocute!!
Throw caution to the wind, but I've got a lousy arm
This is my absolute favourite line! I love it so much, I can't even articulate....
Oh PETE.
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It is here (http://www.buzznet.com/web/foe/photos/clandestine/?id=8611891). OH PETE. ♥
I know, dude, I know! I love it so much, just as a line, and then the way Patrick sounds on it just completely kills me.
<3333
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I kind of want to make your analysis of this song my personal canon, because it fits so perfectly.
And the way Patrick sounds kills me all too often. Good thing I'm not a cat, because I've died way more than 9 times XP
PS - since you didn't show up to class on Wednesday, you're getting your b-day present late! Prolly Saturday.
(Not that I really blame you - not going to class is an awesome birthday present to yourself \o/)
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(That said: "It's Hard to Say 'I Do' When I Don't" is not a bad song. It's actually my album favourite, and I think it does the best job of showing the progression from FUCT to IOH, perhaps why they weren't so in love with it. Structurally it's nothing new for them, and is probably a lot like what a song from TTTYG would sound like with slick production. I think that's really interesting from a musical standpoint as far as what kind of influence producers have over the final song vs. artist's vision. Also, I really like the lyrics! :D I think they're the most straight-forward Pete's ever been without being trite.)
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(Hahahaha, dude, you are probably completely right about that, as well. I know nothing about music, and I phrased that poorly. All I really meant was that I, with my average, pop-oriented, unsophisticated taste, didn't like that song – which means that it's a fair bet it wouldn't be a mainstream hit for them. Whereas G.I.N.A.S.F.S. could be, and they still almost didn't put it on the CD. Ugh, I unironically love, like, Kelly Clarkson, don't take anything I say about music seriously. *vbg*)
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Can you answer me a question from your vast bandslashy knowledge base: what is fandom opinion on Ashlee Simpson with Pete? I'm maybe writing a goddamn story.
Also, Happy Birthday! And I too got a haircut, so let us revel together in mutual cuteitude.
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I really have no idea what the fandom opinion is on Ashlee, frankly, except "she must give good head." But as far as my own personal opinion goes? I think she's probably nicer to him than some of his other girlfriends have been, and judging by the way he smiles when he's around her, she makes him happy. And I think he probably enjoys taking care of her, being the responsible one. There was that line in a recent blogspot update: "im sorry baby. my heart is clumsy. but i love you in a holding your hair back kind of way." I don't really know, just my two cents. :)
Thank you! YAY CUTE HAIR.
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Anyway! See, I'm pretty sure Patrick has blue eyes? And
Ryan'sJeanae's are brown. So I kind of took the trading line to be about Pete leaving Patrick forRyanJeanae. :-( :-( :-( Because I'm silly and tinhatty like that! And then I was like, and Patrick has to sing that. :-( :-( :-(Also, I always thought the same thing about the shoe thing. I mean, seriously. That's pretty gay however you look at it. Not that there's anything wrong with that. :-D
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But see, I think Patrick might actually have brown eyes! *searches her pictures folder* Yeah. It doesn't quite work out! I got frustrated over that line for quite a while, and then I just decided, screw it, it's poetic license. Although now, I'm inclined to think it's not about eyes at all; see
Hahahahaha I know. OH PETE.
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[runs away]
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Good point about the shoes/shirt lines, those are pretty...yeah. And, if it's *not* about something gay, then why would he title it like that (except to fuck with us, which I guess is also valid)? I would KILL to know what this one is really about. And to know if "Bang the Doldrums" is really about Mikeyway.
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I really really wish he would tell us. God, Pete, enough with the cryptic shit!
THAT SAID: if Bang the Doldrums is not about Mikeyway, I will eat my hat.
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The pulling two separate 'you's' out of it makes a whole lot of sense, on any level. I love it!
The recent buzznet post really made me flash to Ryan Ross on the Panic DVD saying he was wearing girls deodorant because it made him feel less lonely. Also, it's made me stare really hard at any pictures of people wearing said hoodie.
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Yay! Thank you!
Hahahahahahaha yeah, me too. I kind of love it when these boys talk about smells, is that weird? Like, that whole segment on LotMS when they're talking about how they smell bad. I just find it kind of, I don't know. They SMELL EACH OTHER for WEEKS ON END, how wonderful is that? I love that! It's so, I don't know, irritating and personal and AWESOME. Patrick and Pete's messiness on tour annoying Andy and Joe pleases me for much the same reason.
/freak
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Secondly, I kind of love this speculation because hello, gayest song ever? Plus the shirt and the wearing of it? I am going to walk around thinking of it all day.
trade baby blues for wide-eyed browns
Things aren't the same anymore
Some nights it gets so bad
I almost pick up the phone
Trade baby blues for wide eyed browns
I sleep with your old shirts
And walk through this house in your shoes
I know it's strange
It's a strange way of saying
That I know I'm supposed to love you
I'm supposed to love you
Which is a little confusing, with the fact that Patrick's eyes are blue, and we certainly don't want to take this to mean that he's trading in Patrick for someone else. But, if you change the break between the sections, to:
Things aren't the same anymore
Some nights it gets so bad
I almost pick up the phone
Trade baby blues for wide eyed browns
I sleep with your old shirts
And walk through this house in your shoes
I know it's strange
It's a strange way of saying
That I know I'm supposed to love you
I'm supposed to love you
That's only a simple change, but if you ignore way Patrick sings the lines in the song (the longer pause that matches the first set of lyrics), it totally makes sense! As you said, some nights it gets so bad that Pete almost falls back into old (bad) habits and calls his ex. If he did that, he would be trading baby blues (Patrick) for wide-eyed browns (the ex). Instead, he gets through it by sleeping with Patricks old shirts, etc.
Anyway, just thought I'd share.
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